370,000 migrants claiming benefits

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Re: 370,000 migrants claiming benefits

Postby admin » Fri May 18, 2012 7:07 pm

Corrie wrote:Thanks for your comments. I'd just like to add that what I absolutely abhor is the use of the words "diatribe of bile and hatred". Each and everyone of us has an opinion and my thoughts on opinions are, no right, no wrong, its just an opinion, and I stand by my opinion without showing any bile or hatred. I am not a racist either.


Not saying anyone on here is, Corrie....but a forum owner is responsible for the posts of members if they break the law. We all know the law is an ass..but there are people who trawl the internet looking for something against which to take offence....and they could interpret some of what was said as racist. After all, we now live in a world, or at least I live in a country where you can be prosecuted for calling someone a tink, can be charged with racism for banning an Englishman from a pub and, while it is AOK to call someone a Scottish a-hole....heaven forbid that you dare call an English person in Scotland an English a-hole.....because while the first is not racist in Scotland, the second is. Is it the same in England?

I certainly don't think that any posts were "full of bile and hatred"...that was an opinion based on an opinion of what qualified as bile and hatred, just as every other post, including mine are simply opinions....but what many of the posts did do was attribute hatred and other unacceptable traits to large swathes of people living in the UK from a basis of no knowledge about anything but what one of the nastiest UK newspapers fed the public. It is just a short hop from there to naming specific groups.....like the Romanians in the other article and then we could be in trouble, particularly if they are also travellers.

It shouldn't be hard to use the words some, a proportion....even many.... rather than simply trash all people without qualification. We choose ourselves how we express our opinions, and I have never liked blanketing whole demographies (bar politicians) just because some are no better than they should be. I know I'm getting more biased as I get older against various happenings in society today, which wouldn't have bothered me once...I think it is an age thing that makes us veer to the right a bit...but I try never to post on forums things I wouldn't say to a person's face.
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Re: 370,000 migrants claiming benefits

Postby Monika » Fri May 18, 2012 7:35 pm

Thanks for the comments from admin.

I would like to point out though that the people I see in large groups in the city and shopping centres (which I was referring to as non-indigenous) here are not non-whites; they are in fact what we usually refer to nowadays as Eastern Europeans. They certainly are easily recognisable by their dress and the fact that they speak to each other in a language I don't understand; they have been appearing in Nottingham city now for a number of years and we are very used to them and theuir numbers are growing.

I am insulted to be called "racist" as I am most definitely not, nor ever was! Of course, if you knew me at all, you would know that.

Also, I am not full of "bile and hatred" towards immigrants, legal or otherwise; if I were, I would reserve it for the Westminster wets who do very little to stem the tide of illegal immigrants who are a major drain on our ever-diminishing resources.

The people of this country have every right to be worried and every right to say so.
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Re: 370,000 migrants claiming benefits

Postby admin » Fri May 18, 2012 11:12 pm

Monika wrote:Thanks for the comments from admin.

I would like to point out though that the people I see in large groups in the city and shopping centres (which I was referring to as non-indigenous) here are not non-whites; they are in fact what we usually refer to nowadays as Eastern Europeans. They certainly are easily recognisable by their dress and the fact that they speak to each other in a language I don't understand; they have been appearing in Nottingham city now for a number of years and we are very used to them and theuir numbers are growing.

I am insulted to be called "racist" as I am most definitely not, nor ever was! Of course, if you knew me at all, you would know that.

Also, I am not full of "bile and hatred" towards immigrants, legal or otherwise; if I were, I would reserve it for the Westminster wets who do very little to stem the tide of illegal immigrants who are a major drain on our ever-diminishing resources.

The people of this country have every right to be worried and every right to say so.


I hoped I'd not have to post like this. I did hope that members would read the thread with my comments in my first post in mind, and accept my point of view and start to do thinking before posting....but it seems not to have worked.

I'm going to try yet again in this thread to explain where I, as the owner of this forum, and the one who will take the consequences of any crap produced by members which hits the fan...not you or anyone else who produces opinions, but me who doesn't need to say a word anywhere..so not because of what I say, because I do know where to draw the line to err on the side of caution, unlike many on here..but because there are those who think that advancing age entitles them to stop thinking about the impact of their opinions in a different world to the one in which they were brought up. Had an aunt who died at 94 and I physically cringed every time she opened her mouth, but then I do sometimes when my younger sister does as well...and if that offends anybody, I am sorry, but that is reality in the UK today. We can no longer say what we think unless we watch how we say it.....and that is all I am asking members here to do...think how they express their opinions!

It is a long time since I've been able to log in as Oddquine, on the new Rowans, but my old Oddquine sig, all over the internet is "where am I ? And what am I doing in this handbasket?"....and the handbasket is heading straight to hell...but not because of people but because of politicians......but I have great difficulty with those who blame the people taking the piss rather than the politicians who encourage it. Have none of you spent the years before retirement hiding the savings which would mean you can't claim pension credits and the perks you get from that? I know many who have done/do.....and I perceive that they are benefit cheats no different to any other kind.

I have never found that Poles or other Eastern Europeans up here dress that differently from anybody else. What do you mean by differently anyway? Do you mean they wear national dress? Or they wear headscarves because many Eastern Europeans are Muslim? How does that mean they are not British Citizens? Talking in a language among themselves which you don't understand also does not make them not British citizens. If they have been appearing for a number of years, they easily could be.....as the accurate version of the Telegraph crap as reported on the BBC illustrates.

Sorry, Monika...but the terms indigenous and non-indigenous are now in the UK just BNP buzzwords for white, British born for generations Christians...however you care to define them in your own mind..or how they used to be defined...much as anti-semite now applies to those who think that the Israeli government needs a good kick up the backside as well as to the irrational who think that Jews are a danger to the world and need to be exterminated. Definitions change through usage...would you call anyone gay any more?

There are no people in the UK today who could be termed indigenous under any definition of the word....not even our monarchy. Indigenous is Australian Aborigines, New Zealand Maoris, Canadian First Nations or Inuit, Native Americans and most definitely not the mongrel UK peoples who have no idea at all where they originated because it was so far back that they have to do DNA testing to find that we all originated in Africa or somewhere like that.

I didn't call anyone racist..I said that some of the remarks on here could, if someone has a PC hat on, be interpreted as racist..but if you want to take offence at something I didn't say, then I don't suppose I can stop you...but it is being offended because you want to be offended rather than because anyone has been personally offensive to you or anyone on here. Equally I didn't say anything about bile and hatred...and the person who did was not being personal but referring to the tenor of the posts.....and that is what I have been trying to get through to you all....not what you are saying...but how you are saying it.

I have absolutely no problems with trashing our politicians, and do it all over the internet myself, but what so many seem to refuse to see that, while our politicians are all colours, religions etc, they are politicians first and listen to the PC crowd to the exclusion of commonsense......so trashing politicians is acceptable, because you are trashing their jobs not their identities....while trashing the identities of those in a "multicultural" society is a different thing altogether.

I agree that The people of this country have every right to be worried and every right to say so.....but in the end who are "the people of this country"? Are they those who can trace their ancestry back seven generations definitively, as I can, or those who make up their ancestry for even more generations back as the monarchy does..or just those who, as in Scotland, choose to live here and think of themselves as Scots, regardless of origins....and have been here for ten minutes, but can vote in the forthcoming Independence Referendum?

Everyone has a right to an opinion....but they have no right to oblige others like me, to bear the consequences of their perceived right to expound those opinions on forums they don't own. This forum has not yet come to the stage of a succession of posts which would entail prosecuting me because of what the members say...but it could happen...and as we appear to be becoming, over the piece, less inclined to think before posting, maybe it is time to be blunt and tell you all that I will absolutely not accept posts which leave me open to prosecution and I will go in and amend posts I think are unacceptable in tone or thrust.

If you want to have the freedom to say what you like, when you like without watching what you are saying....then I'd advise finding an American based forum where you can be sure that just about everything you say will be covered by their Bill of Rights which allows everything bar personal insults.

I'm not saying I agree with the UK attitude 100%...but it doesn't really matter if I do...I still have to take more notice of it than those of you who are able to type what you like and walk away from any consequences, because if my hosting goes down, so do the forums, the likes of Maisies websites, all my genealogy sites, my gravestone photos etc...or do you all think that a forum on a UK server is not subject to UK law and my hosts won't kick me and every site I host into touch if they are told to?
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Re: 370,000 migrants claiming benefits

Postby ciderman_nz » Sat May 19, 2012 4:20 am

A very reasonable and lucid post , Ma'am.
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Re: 370,000 migrants claiming benefits

Postby dejavou » Sat May 19, 2012 7:52 am

Flippin heck Odds, that's a lot to take in first thing on a morning ......

In answer to your question "who are the people of the UK?" I think I would be right in saying, in the respect of this thread, they are those who have lived here, who have paid their dues and demands to the system, that is have put in, not taken out. Sadly due to the large influx of people from other countries, it is they who, for the most part, shoulder the blame, and the native scroungers get overlooked.

Personally I don't care about what race or religion anybody is, they can be purple, green or sky blue pink with yellow dots on, so long as they treat me how I would treat them AND they respect my right to have different opinions, then that's fine by me.

I agree with your summing up of politicians though, as they are all a bunch of overpaid shysters (in my opinion) who don't have a backbone among them, because if they did, this discussion wouldn't exist
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Re: 370,000 migrants claiming benefits

Postby mazzy » Sat May 19, 2012 11:53 am

Oh dear.....I have kept away from this topic as not many people agree with my views.
Firstly, thanks for explaining your situation to us all Oddie - much appreciated.

I still remember the faces of the early immigrants (late 40's - early 50's). Mainly young West Indian lads who had been encouraged to come here to work. They had their smart new suits, and they were so cold their poor faces were almost white. I think of the excitment aboard The Windrush when they all set out to start a new life, in the country that they considered to be their Mother Country - then the harsh reality. They were treated so badly.

As to the newer immigrants. Why do they come here? Because they can have a better life (they hope) than they can in their home countries. Some are in fear of their lives, others obviously have heard that you can get looked after really well here. What would you do in their position? Take what is offered and try to make a better life....I know what I would do. It is not their fault that the system works this way.

I have more greivance with those who don't/won't work, and think everything is theirs by right. I am glad that I am not a youngster starting off in life, and do fear for the future, not just of my granchildren, but all of the children of this dysfunctional world. world.
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Re: 370,000 migrants claiming benefits

Postby lavonne » Sat May 19, 2012 8:38 pm

You are right ,this Country is reaping what it sowed,people were given passports for siding with Britain in many of their disputes/ wars which could be passed on to their children , many whom were Indian & are here now,what doesnt help is that once established here they then have to bring their elderly relatives over ,& rather than support them, they recieve benefits, My neighbour came with her husband to be near her 2 sons & their families,though they had 2 daughters & a son in Canada, but because her husband couldnt manage stairs to the toilet they were put on 2 housing waiting lists & got a 1 bed flat here,now a widow she does not pay rent because she only receives Pension cedit [ slightly lower than state Pension], both her sons had good jobs & own 2/3 houses each, she flies to Canada every year & gone on Luxury holidays with her family.Another problem is the EU Court of Human Rights, so many times this Country hqs bee blocked from getting someone out of Britain because their lives are in danger elsewhere
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Re: 370,000 migrants claiming benefits

Postby admin » Sun May 20, 2012 12:55 am

ciderman_nz wrote:A very reasonable and lucid post , Ma'am.


I sometimes think I post in Sanskrit, ciderman_nz. :mrgreen:
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Re: 370,000 migrants claiming benefits

Postby rocky » Mon May 21, 2012 3:43 pm

Thank you, Forum Babe/Administrator.

A sensible, well thought-out post. Definitely needed.

And thank you as well, VM. Voices of reason are needed and appreciated.

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